Ep 12: Rich, Successful, and Empty: The Identity Crisis No One Talks About

You made it. The house, the cars, healthy bank account. And somehow... you'd trade it all to go back to when you were broke and hungry.

Weird, right?

Dennis Procopio (The Bro Coach®) and Andrew Bontz crack open this thing successful guys whisper about but never say out loud. Story from Andrew's book club: one guy's got the fancy Zoom backdrop, multiple businesses, the whole deal. The other guy's just starting out, grinding. Mr. Successful drops this bomb: "I'd give anything to be in your shoes."

That's the trap nobody warns you about.

This episode gets into why having money is stressful as hell, why old problems just morph into different ones, and what happens when you grab that golden carrot only to realize... now what? Dennis talks about coaching guys making six figures who want seven, guys making seven figures wondering what the point is, and dudes with millions asking "Who am I?" for the first time.

Also: the Matrix, Pac-Man, Buddhism, and why presence might be the only achievement that matters.

TIMESTAMPS 0:00 - Rich Guy Wants to Start Over 2:40 - Identity and Purpose: The Two Questions 6:27 - Why Having Money Is Actually Stressful 11:05 - Coaching $100K Earners vs. Millionaires 18:30 - Legacy: What Did I Do Besides Make Money? 32:40 - When Success Creates Isolation 40:20 - Presence vs. Achievement: The Pac-Man Analogy 55:45 - The Matrix Reference 58:13 - Incentivizing Presence in Achievement-Driven Life

WHAT YOU'LL LEARN

• Why successful guys secretly wish they could start over
• The two questions driving every man: identity and purpose
• How money creates unexpected stress
• Why hitting goals doesn't reduce problems (just changes them)
• The legacy question haunting high earners
• The friendship paradox wealth creates
• Presence as the only achievement worth chasing

THIS HITS IF YOU'RE

• Making good money but feeling hollowed out
• Successful on paper, empty inside
• Wondering "is this all there is?"
• Burnt out from the achievement treadmill
• Asking "who am I?" for the first time

TAKE ACTION Free 30-minute strategy session: https://www.manuplifecoaching.com/application

CONNECT Website: https://brocoach.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/manuplifecoaching TikTok: https://tiktok.com/@manuplifecoaching

ABOUT THE SHOW The Bro Coach® Podcast with Dennis Procopio. Not red-pill garbage. Not therapy. Real coaching for guys who achieved success but missed the point. Dennis has 25,000+ hours working with high-earning men ($150K to $3M+) who look successful but feel stuck.

Weekly episodes on masculinity, purpose, relationships, wealth psychology, and inner work most men avoid.

RELATED Episode 4: The Achiever's Trap Episode 11: Overcoming Fear in 2026

#IdentityCrisis #WealthPsychology #LifeCoachingForMen #SuccessAndFulfillment #ModernMasculinity #TheBroCoach #ManUpLifeCoaching #ExecutiveCoaching

Dennis Procopio, The Bro Coach® | Andrew Bontz, CRO

TAKE ACTION Free 30-minute strategy session: https://www.manuplifecoaching.com/application

CONNECT Website: https://brocoach.com Instagram: https://instagram.com/manuplifecoaching TikTok: https://tiktok.com/@manuplifecoaching YouTube: https://youtube.com/@manuplifecoaching

ABOUT THE SHOW The Bro Coach® Podcast with Dennis Procopio. Not red-pill garbage. Not therapy. Real coaching for guys who achieved success but missed the point. Dennis has 25,000+ hours working with high-earning men ($150K to $3M+) who look successful but feel stuck.

Transcript

00:00:00:06 - 00:00:27:13
Andrew
Most men want more. More clarity. More respect. More control over their lives. But few know how to get it. Welcome to the pro coach podcast with Dennis Procopio, the founder of Man Up Life Coaching and the man behind thousands of transformed lives. Not red pill, not therapy. Just the evolved man's blueprint for strength, presence and purpose. Welcome to episode 12 of the Bro Coach podcast.

00:00:27:14 - 00:00:31:16
Andrew
I am Andrew Bontz and I'm here with Dennis Procopio.

00:00:31:18 - 00:00:48:19
Dennis
Hey, I'm Dennis. I am the owner of Man Up Life Coaching, where I have earned the nickname over the past more than a decade now the bro coach. And here on the road coach, we're going to talk to guys about some guy stuff. Andrew, kick us off.

00:00:48:21 - 00:00:57:17
Andrew
Yeah. So I was I'm in a entrepreneurial book club. It's a book and verb isn't club. Super manly, but.

00:00:57:19 - 00:00:58:20
Dennis
No, I pretty much. Yeah.

00:00:58:20 - 00:01:31:19
Andrew
Yes he is. And joking. But, it's cool. I, we, we are in a conversation a couple of weeks ago, and there's two guys. There's the Uber successful, probably multimillion multimillionaire, multiple businesses. He's got fancy cars in his garage. He's got a house. It could be an ATV, a fancy wine bottle rack repo right behind his video on zoom.

00:01:31:21 - 00:01:51:00
Andrew
And then there's this other guy who's kind of like, in the first year of his business, he's just kind of coming up. And the new guy, the good guy, is going to get it going. Shared his story where he's like, yeah, man, I'm just getting going. It's a grind. You know, just kind of starting to make money, but not a lot.

00:01:51:02 - 00:02:34:23
Andrew
And the thing that floored me was the guy with the fancy house and, you know, from the outside looking in, looks like he has it all right. But he said, man, I would give anything to be in your shoes to the guy who's just getting going. And you and I have had conversations about this topic a lot, but the question I have for you is, why do men who look like they have everything or they have everything they thought they ever wanted, but they feel like it's not either enough or it's not what they thought it was, or they maybe they heard it all down to start over again because they're bored.

00:02:35:03 - 00:02:40:12
Andrew
Like, why does that happened?

00:02:40:14 - 00:03:11:23
Dennis
Well, so when I first started this business, I was in my 40s, and my ideal plan at that time was a guy in his 20s. I had come from a lot of experience as a teen art teacher. And so I'm in my 30s. I'm coaching guys in their teens going into college. I get into my 40s, I start coaching guys in their 20s just trying to make it out there.

00:03:11:24 - 00:03:51:17
Dennis
Now, in my 50s, I find myself coaching guys in their 20s. Yeah, but really more like my target demographic is kind of 30, 30 something to 50 something with the Strangler, 60 something and the Strat with 20 something. So if you divide that demographic in class, there are the 30 somethings who are trying to buy their first house, have their first kid, and are really grinding to may, a family and establish themselves in their career.

00:03:51:19 - 00:04:27:05
Dennis
If you take my guys that are in their 50s, for these, in 50s, sometimes 60s, you're going to find a certain percentage of those dudes who have kind of made their money. I won't put anybody on blast, but I have some guys in their 30s who have millions. I have some guys in their 40s who have millions and and of course, guys in their 50s who have millions and what they're trying to reconcile for themselves now.

00:04:27:05 - 00:05:05:14
Dennis
And I see this almost in every one of these recordings is guys are always ultimately answering two questions. One is a question of identity and one is a question of purpose. It's who am I and why am I? So while you are trying to, you know, you're trying to get another play to have. Hey, you know, while you're scratching away, trying to, provide for form, there's this, you know, there's this carrot.

00:05:05:16 - 00:05:27:16
Dennis
But what happens when you're holding the golden carrot and you're like, I not only have this golden carrot, you check it into a pile of golden carrots behind you and you're like, well, there you go. I did the thing. Now what? And did for the first time causes guys to say.

00:05:27:18 - 00:06:27:04
Dennis
I am concerned about my legacy. What will I have done besides make a pile of money? And also, nobody told me that having money would make me stressed out. It's really stressful having all this money, and that sounds like everybody's. Wish I had no problem. You say that. So in answer to your question, one of the things that people don't understand when they're trying to make their first million is it only gets the game, gets more compulsive as you move up, and invariably you're going to start creating a lifestyle that causes you to depend on large sums of money.

00:06:27:06 - 00:07:03:05
Dennis
And large sums of money are scary. And even if you feel financially secure and like you have enough of a pile of money that you can sort of slow down and say, okay, here's where I leave the casino. Now you have this challenge, which is, okay, now what? What do I do on my friendships, real friendships? Can I can I find friends who have the time that I haven't?

00:07:03:07 - 00:07:46:20
Dennis
Yeah. Then how can I have friends who will come along and be able to do fun things with me, without me feeling obligated to treat them? Which is gonna create a weird power dynamic. Or without me saying, I guess I can only hang out with the Billionaire Boys Club or whatever, you know? So my relationship to my kids, my relationship to my wife, and frankly, just my relationship to spirituality and and the world, I feel like I've kind of put myself in a bubble where I'm sort of removed from, you know, the common experience at this point.

00:07:46:22 - 00:08:22:20
Dennis
My point is the problems. Old problems become new problems. You have different problems. But I have not seen that having money, sufficiently reduces stress, increases happiness, or changes the sort of number of problems that you're going to be dealing with.

00:08:22:22 - 00:08:49:17
Andrew
Yeah, I think, you know, is it. Put myself in. It was just it's it's kind of floored me right in the moment or seeing this guy, it's like, man, I wish, I wish, I wish I could go back of your shoes and do it all over again. Right? And makes me think of the men that either be consciously or subconsciously, they hit a certain a roller coaster ride and they hit.

00:08:49:17 - 00:09:18:18
Andrew
They kind of hit the top. Maybe it's top of their own beliefs and what they can accomplish. Or maybe it's, you know, dealing with all kinds of trauma that's not going to get them forward or maybe it's their perception of money or identity stuff or whatever, and then they'll, like, make choices to at least I've seen it in my life, right where I, you know, I, I did it before I got a coach right where I would life would be going good, be going good, be going good.

00:09:18:18 - 00:09:43:07
Andrew
And you're kind of riding riding this high of growth, you know, with stuff and money and businessy things. And then you hit a point where you're like, oh, wow, I'm doing pretty well. And then you get like this shiny object syndrome. You're like, okay, well, this is kind of getting boring. So I like I liked the challenge in the grind.

00:09:43:07 - 00:10:03:07
Andrew
Maybe I'll stop doing this and I'll pick up this shiny object, and then I'll build this and build this and build this. And some entrepreneurs can do it, you know, multiple businesses. And can I get them all off the ground? But then it sounds like you get to a certain point, it's like, oh, why did I do all that?

00:10:03:09 - 00:10:05:04
Andrew
And at what cost that?

00:10:05:10 - 00:10:25:18
Dennis
So again, by the way, just let me give you a little let you know, just, I think there's a you're you're coming in a little lower segment on a check mic input. Yeah. So, so based on based on what you're sharing here, it's.

00:10:25:20 - 00:11:05:22
Dennis
It's something that I talked to, all the time, about, you know, with guys, you know, we have these conversations. There are some guys who are making 100 and, to $200,000. They're, idea right now is that they're trying to crank that number up higher. So if I have a guy who's making between 102 hundred, usually his goal is to be earning between 203 hundred, or in the best case, even 4 or 500.

00:11:05:24 - 00:11:36:03
Dennis
It depends on how he's making his money. Like if he's just starting out in tech. He's I think he's expecting at a certain point to be making between 3 and 5. Like, that's his game. That's his goal. So fun fact I have been working with client now for a while. Who just in his early 50s, and I'll try to be careful not to give too much information.

00:11:36:03 - 00:12:14:08
Dennis
But in his early 50s, when he came into our coaching, he was making probably he was making us, let's just say, in keeping with my numbers, he was making a string six figure salary, something closer to a half million, or, and because he's somebody who wasn't born with a silver spoon, you know, he had the idea. Hey, I've sucked, sucked a few times away, you know, like in my portfolio, I've got two or 2 or 3 million to kind of fall back on.

00:12:14:10 - 00:12:41:15
Dennis
But also I have kids and also I have a quality of life. And also once I, once I leave the casino, like it's not easy for me to just jump back into a position where I'm making this kind of money again, like I've got the bases loaded and they're, you know, they're nicknaming Ming Ming. But if I step off because I burn out like a Navy Seal, if I ring the bell and then decide, oh, wait, you know, I think I made a mistake, a mistake.

00:12:41:20 - 00:13:19:24
Dennis
Let me try it again. Nah. Sorry, Charlie. You you had it and you shut it down. So that creates a sort of a fear based incentive for him to stay in the game. And that's how you get the golden handcuffs. Now, in the case of this particular dude who I'm thinking of, he had a life changing event happened that sort of gave him a windfall that completely changed the value of money for him.

00:13:20:01 - 00:13:52:18
Dennis
Because of this windfall. That is the it's not a question of if, it's a question of when, and it's probably sooner than later. He's recognizing I don't have to continue to spend 60 to 80 hours a week grinding away at this executive level position for a legacy enterprise corporation.

00:13:52:20 - 00:14:23:02
Dennis
Because doing so might put another half a half a mill in my bank account. But also I have kids, I have a wife, and I have a wife. At what point do I say I need to stop living to work and start working to live? And with this payload that I am about to be lucky enough to have access to, I can live on the draw.

00:14:23:04 - 00:14:38:04
Dennis
So now my new question becomes. What do I what do I do with the times? What do I do?

00:14:38:06 - 00:14:54:15
Dennis
With all of the stress that I had because my identity was okay, I get the money, I to get the money, I got to get the money, I got to get the money, work work work work work work work work work. Well. My whole value system is based on being the worker who gets the money. So now my reward is.

00:14:54:15 - 00:15:17:17
Dennis
Now I'm apparently the frivolous grasshopper. I don't know that I want to be the frivolous grasshopper. I've been told that it's bad to be the frivolous grasshopper. And along comes coach Dennis Guru to the freaking. To the thick, you know, at least kind of wealthy.

00:15:17:19 - 00:15:37:23
Dennis
Which is bizarre because I come from, like, okay, like nothing. And I say somewhere along the way, you have to make decisions about impact.

00:15:38:00 - 00:16:26:19
Dennis
When you're on your deathbed, when you look back. What time expenditure will you think had the most impact on your legacy? And for a lot of my guys, it presents. I want to be able to say that I earn enough money to get off the trade or not money, but financial security to get off the treadmill and to be available to go, you know, watch my kids do,

00:16:26:21 - 00:16:36:16
Dennis
BJJ tournament that, you know, at eight, ten years old probably isn't going to amount to anything, but at least, you know, dad was there.

00:16:36:18 - 00:17:00:11
Dennis
I want to be able to say that when my wife was telling me about some book that she read, my mind wasn't racing to other things that were more important. I was fully engaged. Oh, please tell me more about me and Elizabeth and this book that you're reading about the whatever papacy or whatever. I am all in on that.

00:17:00:13 - 00:17:10:00
Dennis
This matters to you. So it matters to me. And most importantly, and this is huge.

00:17:10:02 - 00:17:34:11
Dennis
I want to be able to fall into a routine of doing things that, yes, give me joy, but I don't want to do them because they give me joy, because then that sets the precedent that I'm kind of like my ADHD is going to kick in and I'm going to do things until I burn out, and then I'm going to do other things.

00:17:34:13 - 00:17:59:08
Dennis
And even though I have the money, I don't want to be the guy who says, okay, now I'm into being a music and spends, you know, bunch of money on equipment. And okay, now I'm into boating and goes out and buys a boat, and now I'm into horses. So, so I want to do something that makes me that I can be happy doing, but I don't necessarily want my purpose for doing it.

00:17:59:10 - 00:18:36:12
Dennis
I'm doing it because it makes me happy. So now I have to evaluate my man code and say, why do I do anything? And that begins to bring us to the second question, the philosophical question of what's my job here? And we always come back to the idea that your job is that your job is purpose. So and service your your purpose is service.

00:18:36:12 - 00:19:06:15
Dennis
Sorry if I said that. Weird. Your purpose is service. So who do you serve? Well, the guy in question, who I was just telling you about. He seems like someone who is going to become an important part of the man up life coaching, Platinum Brain Club. Will that manifest as him being a coach? Will that manifest? Is him being leadership in or admin?

00:19:06:21 - 00:19:42:23
Dennis
Will that manifest as him being the guy who single handedly puts together the, you know, the international barbecue meet up or what? Moping, man up, life coaching? I don't know, man, but your purpose should be something that serves the greater good. It should be something that gives you joy. And on days when it doesn't give you joy, you should say, good.

00:19:43:00 - 00:19:54:18
Dennis
That means it's work. And just because I have a whole bunch of money doesn't mean I'm, you know, too fancy to work right?

00:19:54:20 - 00:20:02:07
Dennis
I'm going to sleep on a pile of money and still have calluses on my hands. No matter.

00:20:02:09 - 00:20:07:00
Andrew
Yeah, right. That'd be the guy with, like, soft hands getting fed grapes, you know?

00:20:07:02 - 00:20:43:18
Dennis
Yeah. You know, it's so weird. Like, every time I shake a dude's hand and it just collapses, like. Like I just grabbed a slice of baloney. I'm embarrassed. I feel a an immediate sense of distrust. Like, I do believe that there's something there where, as a man, you should have a handshake that communicate. I do see things with this man.

00:20:43:20 - 00:20:49:00
Dennis
But you know. Oh, yeah. But yeah.

00:20:49:02 - 00:20:57:12
Andrew
You know, it's just like you, the people that don't quite do the whole, like, lead with the the inside of your thumb.

00:20:57:16 - 00:20:59:20
Dennis
Oh yeah. Lock in your thumbs and yeah, you.

00:20:59:22 - 00:21:03:06
Andrew
Grab too early and you're like, oh no I got to shake these fingers.

00:21:03:06 - 00:21:41:17
Dennis
It's the classics. We all know it. Yeah. Yeah. So anyway, back to your original question. So what? So speak to the idea that you you're hanging out. You're you're thinking, hey, you know, I can't to wait to make it like some of these big money homeboys here. And yet I'm listening to one of these big money homeboys, and he's saying, boy, I envy this guy who doesn't have the problems that come with this level of, you know, responsibility.

00:21:41:19 - 00:22:38:14
Dennis
So. When I create content, the content I'm creating is for the people who the men who are perceptive enough to recognize. I think this coach has some things that just using AI, we're using coaches who operate like I, don't satisfy, which is everything you're going to see out there for accountability. Coaching is going to be instructions and maintenance techniques for achieving the goals that, you know, satisfy a high self-esteem, which is what we've talked about before,

00:22:38:16 - 00:23:06:16
Dennis
This is who I am on paper. I can mattresses my value because I've got the house or houses, the car or cars, the boat or boats. I travel, little there little indicators that I'm in the cool kid club, my watch, my belt, my shoes, whatever. I'm just talking about things that people talk about who run in the circles.

00:23:06:16 - 00:23:51:09
Dennis
I'm, you know, I'm tipping my hand that I'm in the in the cool kid club. And so on paper, you check off the, self-esteem box. This is who society sees me have as. This is my extrinsic value. But they discover after all of the that they're still working on their intrinsic value, self-worth. I remember, you know, I'm 55 back in the day listening to Morrissey and the Smiths, Morrissey had a line famously was just like in the days when you were hopelessly poor.

00:23:51:09 - 00:24:31:21
Dennis
I just liked you more. And there's something to be said for that. Okay, now, yeah, there's all this money. Let's talk about your character, and let's talk about who you are in the middle of the night, looking at yourself in the mirror when nobody's around and watching. Do you feel at peace, produced feel feel a tremendous amount of anxiety and confusion and unrest and uncertainty and even more directionless now, because having enough money to do anything begs the question, why do anything so.

00:24:31:23 - 00:24:53:16
Andrew
So I mean, one of the things that I heard in his story, or is he was like missing the chase, like he was missing the challenge. Like, how does that fit in to this whole identity?

00:24:53:18 - 00:25:05:12
Andrew
Shifter issue or the who am I? What am I thinking?

00:25:05:14 - 00:26:05:23
Dennis
Okay, so the reason that men historically aborted the concept of a participation trophy is because the trophy represents something that you have to really be excellent to achieve. And that validation is worth the work. I have a client right now in New York. He's, young man who's kind of crushing it over it. Oh, sacks. Yeah. And, he ran a, he was he was a he was out of shape because when he first started, got out of, got out of college, started, you know, working in this space, you know, you work in 90 hours a week, and it was just sitting at a desk, you know, eating, you know, cheeseburgers for

00:26:05:23 - 00:26:28:10
Dennis
comfort, you know, and, you know, taking a little nap on the floor under your desk, popping back up and doing it all over. So after a while, he just looked like crap. He looked like that was his lifestyle. He got fat. His eyes just looked like he stares at, you know, a screen all day. And when he moved to New York, he made the decision.

00:26:28:12 - 00:26:53:22
Dennis
I don't want to be this guy anymore. And he just stopped making excuses and dropped a whole bunch of weight, and he used running to do it. And so once he was doing this, I can't. As long as I'm running all around Manhattan, let me go ahead and run the marathon. And first he ran a half a marathon, and the half marathon made him want to run a marathon.

00:26:53:24 - 00:27:46:12
Dennis
And now that he's run a marathon, now he wants to do it again. But now he wants to get his time Down under, whatever ten minute mile or or whatever he managed. What is that? It. It's the thrill of the chase. It's the idea that if I work hard enough, I'm going to get this big payout. And the payout always, always, always in some way has to do with this surge of this, this, this, this word that is just intoxicating validation.

00:27:46:14 - 00:28:02:05
Dennis
Imagine a curtain call after like a successful Broadway production, like hamlet, for all the work that went into that, when they're taking their curtain call and they're having people throw roses at them, the reality is.

00:28:02:07 - 00:28:04:15
Dennis
Like.

00:28:04:17 - 00:28:34:16
Dennis
No, I want to do it again. Like I did it. I got the thing. Yes, this is wonderful. But it immediately leads me to wanting to seek my new my new challenge. Now, in Manaf Life Coaching, we say that validation, which is where it starts, leads to motivation. Motivation. Engender confidence. Confidence leads to, risk taking rather than risk avoidance.

00:28:34:18 - 00:29:04:21
Dennis
Risk taking leads to change, and change creates opportunities. And as you embark on those opportunities, you achieve success. But if you're too successful, quote unquote. If every time I go fishing, I just drop a hook in the water and I catch my bag limit and like five minutes, like that's going to make me go, let me fish for something a little bit more elusive.

00:29:04:23 - 00:29:21:00
Dennis
Let me try using lures instead of baits. Let me try using barbless hooks. Let me up the ante here because I want to keep it somewhere in that grime.

00:29:21:02 - 00:30:18:21
Dennis
Is a sweet spot and being present at a moment while you're grinding that you understand the journey is the destination. That's why people forget gurus and try to achieve enlightenment. Bro. Why do you think it's all these frickin Uber rich people who all have, you know, who all head east and start finding like Tibetan rumpus shades and shit and now, like Richard Deer and all those those George Clooney, like all of those guys, you know, or like, and the guy who I think one of the people who I think has figured it out, which is why he's such an anomaly and why he's so popular, is, Keanu Reeves.

00:30:18:23 - 00:30:46:22
Dennis
Keanu Reeves is a perfect demonstration of the balance between high self-esteem, because we all know the guy. He's done some stuff. Matrix, John Wick, all of it, you know? But, willing to add whatever. It is, though, you know, strange things are afoot in the matrix, bro. I know kung fu, whatever, but but he's authentic.

00:30:46:22 - 00:31:21:04
Dennis
He's himself. And he's still a guy who doesn't subscribe to the idea that money and status change foundationally and energetically. Who and what you are? High self-worth, high self-esteem. I get the feeling that if this dude lost all of his money, it would not fundamentally change who he is as a person, or how he engages with life, or how he feels about himself or his obligation, his his, call to service to humanity.

00:31:21:06 - 00:31:23:15
Dennis
Pete, that.

00:31:23:17 - 00:31:43:09
Andrew
Some here and channel Keanu Reeves. Yeah. I, I just need to grow some really long hair, and, I don't talk a little slow or.

00:31:43:11 - 00:31:49:08
Dennis
I mean, I don't know how that hair part's going to work out for you. It doesn't seem to be transference.

00:31:49:10 - 00:32:03:11
Andrew
I hear people like heading to Nepal or something like that, where they can get, like, some sort of. Or the Netherlands or something, where they can get some pretty, pretty fancy hair stuff going on. But, you know, I think I think I'm good. I am.

00:32:03:11 - 00:32:23:22
Dennis
I was just going to say I'm, I'm, I, I leaned in to being, being, a bald guy with, you know, with face like this, pretty early on in life, and it hasn't hurt my numbers, so I think I'm sticking with it. But, you know, if I could be honest, but. Yeah, but but the.

00:32:24:01 - 00:32:36:06
Dennis
So what's what the what is what is what is imitative about a guy like, kind of rips back to your back to your original, your original deal.

00:32:36:10 - 00:33:01:19
Andrew
Hey, man, stop spinning your wheels. If you're serious about leveling up your career, your relationships, and your mindset, it's time to man up at man up Life Coaching. We cut the excuses and build discipline, confidence, and purpose. Book your free strategy session now at Man Up Life Coaching e-commerce application. Don't fill it out if you're not ready to grind, but if you are, this call could change your life.

00:33:01:21 - 00:33:06:04
Andrew
Man up life coaching, elite life coaching for men by men.

00:33:06:06 - 00:33:28:14
Dennis
I think he's a guy who's made decisions for himself about what his moral and ethical codes are, and I think that he leads with that. Another, another celebrity actor who I think does the same thing is, and these are all guys, you know, I'm, I'm showing my age by the people that I'm, referencing. But, Jim Carrey is another one.

00:33:28:16 - 00:34:05:20
Dennis
Jim Carrey started from, you know, and kind of, you know, very meager beginnings in Ohio. And, you know, wrote himself a $10 million check, but it in his wallet filled himself with cash this someday. And he did. But along the way, he's never lost his, his moral compass. And when you see these guys start to age and start to get up there and years like me and start to have that salt and pepper, you know, like you're still look good, but I see where you're headed.

00:34:05:20 - 00:34:37:09
Dennis
You're headed to the Clint Eastwood pasture, you know, you know, when you have your when you have your shit straight, it makes it a lot easier. He's one of those people who I think has maintained his moral integrity. You see a person and I'm not hating on him, but I'm just keeping it real. You see a person like Kanye, I think Kanye is an example of somebody who has very, very high, self-esteem.

00:34:37:11 - 00:35:16:08
Dennis
And so, yeah, he has the money. He has the recognition, but he is someone who is clearly still not at peace. You know, so a a guy like Keanu Reeves, if he were able to be a friend to a guy like Kanye, would invariably end up being in a mentorship position because he'd be teaching him, hey, man, I'm not trying to criticize you in any way, but something's off with your energy, bro.

00:35:16:10 - 00:35:41:17
Dennis
Something's unresolved. You're not at peace, and it's always going to be in that self self-worth department. You know, I'd love to see. I'd love to see a gun. A guy like Kanye go for Forrest Gump and just start. Just start walking like, fuck it, dude. I'm checking out. Just start walking. You know, I'm going to walk and grow a beard.

00:35:41:19 - 00:36:15:07
Andrew
So as you look at like this, self-worth for self esteem, if how does goal setting come into play? Because I think most high achievers, goal setting exercises are very self esteem based. Right. So as you're trying to become more balance, it it like what does goal setting look like if you have a if you're trying to cover both bases.

00:36:15:09 - 00:36:40:14
Dennis
That's again, we're back to why I was saying that ChatGPT and these other AIS will never replace good mentors because as you know, you're you're on my marketing team, dude. You know what time it is. We've been trying to look for the secret sauce that we're able to bottle and sell that distinctly makes man up life coaching what it is.

00:36:40:16 - 00:37:27:07
Dennis
When I'm out there in those mean Instagram streets, all the women are out there making the decision for me that I'm an annotate minion, that I am a Joe Rogan minion. That or mouthpiece that I am that I promote toxic masculinity. That I just do a whole bunch of quote, hootenanny, follow and for incels, and it's actually and so I write, I can't, I can't believe the amount of time I spend, like on Instagram writing these long, incredibly vulnerable paragraphs, saying things like, that's not who I am.

00:37:27:09 - 00:38:11:09
Dennis
I actually come from a completely different background. You know, and the more, vulnerable and open and honest I am, the more they demonstrate why it's impossible to reason with people who start off with an unshakable narrative. They actually don't want to hear what you have to say. They've made a decision. And so when you were. In a space like mine where you have a brand like Man Up Life Coaching, you have to recognize there's a double entendre here.

00:38:11:09 - 00:38:38:18
Dennis
On one hand, yes, I am playing to the I am playing the shame game a little bit, which is like, you know, don't be a pussy. You set a plan, you know, execute a discipline, get results and keep it moving. Don't tell me you didn't go to school because it was snowing. You didn't go to school because you decided not to go to school.

00:38:38:18 - 00:39:10:12
Dennis
And you used snow as your excuse. How do I know? Because I've walked to school in the snow, you know, with a big frickin pack of books on my back. And I was one of five kids there when the busses weren't running. Right. So what does that mean? What was what is what is the point? The point is, when you're coaching a guy and telling him to man up, you are in a way, playing to his fear of being a little bitch, right?

00:39:10:14 - 00:39:34:14
Dennis
But at the same time, the double entendre is, hey, man down, no bueno. We're here for you, man. Like the old Bill Withers song Lean on Me like you know, if you just might have a problem that you know and I'll be there. Come on and lean on me. I'll give you a hand I'll be your shoulder.

00:39:34:14 - 00:39:57:09
Dennis
He ain't heavy. He's my brother. I thought you and that brotherly love. And any dude listening to that, I'll get a little tear in his eye. Listen to that. Because any bro would help another bro that he saw hurting, not suffering. Because you should suffer that I'm not going to lift your fucking weight for you. You lift your weight.

00:39:57:09 - 00:40:15:13
Dennis
That's what makes you stronger. But when you're trying to pull it, I'm going to go. You got this, you got this. Don't give up mental toughness. Come on, let's go. Strength. Showing strength right. And when the guy actually moves that weight, that's when you give him a big bro hug like you did it, man. And he's like, thanks for not giving up on me.

00:40:15:13 - 00:40:38:07
Dennis
Thanks for believing in me. That's what that mental support is put in. In another context. Dude needs to leave his wife. Hey bro, I'm here for you. I know it's hard, but it's the right thing to do. Should you know the spot is blown. The ship has sailed. And the guide who's there with you, that's just like, look, man, if you need somebody to help pack your shit, I got you.

00:40:38:09 - 00:41:00:11
Dennis
Hey, man, I need. You know, if you're feeling a little sensitive, you know, and in your feelings, like, don't you have to worry that you sound like a chick because you're sitting alone in your room and going, I'm sad. Like I need somebody that I could trust to talk to, but I want I want to talk to my dude friend because then all of a sudden, let it go.

00:41:00:13 - 00:41:56:21
Dennis
Fuck it. And pussy, you know, like the so the man up double entendre is man up means yes, you need to check those accountability boxes, but also you need to understand the mechanism by which you were down and are now up. And the secret ingredient to the Krabby Patty formula is love, as I have been saying forever. So as the longest answer in the world to how do you how do you reframe your value system so that you go from setting achievable goals as a way of incrementally earning your black belt in, external achievement land?

00:41:56:23 - 00:42:20:24
Dennis
How do you what goals do you set? How do you mattress size and incentivize incremental steps toward self-worth? Well, how the frick do you incentivize and mattress size self-love? That's the question you're asking.

00:42:21:01 - 00:42:29:01
Andrew
Why are we not metric size? But I mean, I mean, I think yes, there's a process to it. Right? Sorry. No, no, it isn't a process to it. Yeah.

00:42:29:02 - 00:42:57:01
Dennis
No, it's a switch that you can flip at any time. And the only reason that people go in by degrees is the same reason that they don't jump into a cold, frickin body of water, but you can do it that way. That's why this coaching doesn't have to take ten years, but it often does, because it's hard for dudes to make themselves instantly emotionally vulnerable.

00:42:57:03 - 00:43:04:24
Dennis
But it's theoretically a switch that you can tackle at any time.

00:43:05:01 - 00:43:29:07
Dennis
You can tell it out here, let me, rather than live, live in the valley here, you being you listener. If. If you make the decision for yourself that moving forward, any time I serve myself, choosing an emotion that.

00:43:29:09 - 00:43:57:05
Dennis
Supported by a narrative that supports fear over faith, I am going to choose an alternative. In that moment. So it's always the same choice. It's fear over faith. Now here they come. Well, faith. And what exactly are we talking? Are we talking? Jesus died on the cross for my sins. Because if that's not what your faith is in, then we're going to have a bad time.

00:43:57:07 - 00:44:24:01
Dennis
Are we talking Allah? Are we talking Hashem? Are we talking faith in quantum entanglement? Like where? What are we talking about? Faith. And and that's where you lose everybody. Because while everybody is out there trying to define. The terms and conditions for understanding that self-love and brotherly love are the same thing and that they are not done incrementally.

00:44:24:03 - 00:44:45:16
Dennis
They're either done fully or not at all. There are no degrees to love. There are no degrees to faith. You. You're to have faith or you don't. And you are neither any of the love or you don't. What is? You get it? I thought we were going to talk, man. Shit. Yeah, well, you know what? I got news.

00:44:45:18 - 00:45:04:09
Dennis
The further up the ladder to go, the. The more you realize that an alpha male in the truest sense is a husband, is a father is a brother is a son, and is someone who understands that your strength is your ability to be in service to others.

00:45:04:11 - 00:45:33:12
Dennis
And to love others. Absolutely. And the way to love others absolutely is to recognize, yeah, I can turn the other cheek. Does that mean I'm a sin? No. I'm fully aware of my abilities to to to fire back if I need to. But it choose not to. I choose not to because I am giving this attacker the space they need to learn that every time you attack, you're always only attacking yourself.

00:45:33:18 - 00:46:38:17
Dennis
And that is an expression of self-hate, not self-love. And with every one of these attacks that you were able to genuinely absorb with love and with the intention of having that person learn that lesson and grow from it. You were reinforcing your faith and your reinforcing the validity of this message. Now, as you're doing this, whether you have 3 million or 10 million doesn't really matter to you, because suddenly you begin to understand that your identity and your purpose are shin right here, and that when you operate in this way and begin to see through this lens and feel scary word, but feel with this bigness of heart without being overwhelmed by how terrifying this

00:46:38:17 - 00:47:15:06
Dennis
ocean that you're swimming in, potentially it's that's when you start to have the moments that are so empowering that they hit harder, even than those dopamine validation moments where you get the trophy. The hot girl, the spot on, you know, Tonino and or or HBO or or Netflix or whatever. That's where the value is. Picking this up, because I'm putting it down.

00:47:15:12 - 00:47:17:11
Andrew
And I hear it, I feel.

00:47:17:11 - 00:47:18:13
Dennis
It. What are your thoughts?

00:47:18:13 - 00:47:27:10
Andrew
Respectfully, I think, but you don't me, I am. I miss you very much. An analytic process.

00:47:27:12 - 00:47:29:19
Dennis
And you're a pragmatist. You're pregnant. Yeah.

00:47:29:19 - 00:47:39:21
Andrew
So it's funny where it's like, I, I think using your language and, I'm, I'm purpose. I'm kind of trying to square a circle. Right. Or circle a square or whatever.

00:47:39:21 - 00:47:42:13
Dennis
That square. Circle. Yeah.

00:47:42:15 - 00:48:06:00
Andrew
The, here because it's like. All right, well, you talk about me and you kind of living the journey versus pursuing a destination, right? Because, like, the achievers path is like, I'm climbing the summit. I'm climbing the summit. I'm at the top of the summit. Oh, there's another mountain. I'm gonna go climb that mountain because it's bigger than this mountain.

00:48:06:00 - 00:48:06:20
Andrew
Right.

00:48:06:22 - 00:48:07:15
Dennis


00:48:07:17 - 00:48:30:17
Andrew
And then, like, the the live your journey side of things is like, you still climb the mountain, but you look around, you be like, hey, man, that's the most beautiful flower. And look at that crazy tree. And holy cow, this is wonderful. Like, and kind of having that sense of wonderment as you're, as you're climbing the mountain, right?

00:48:30:19 - 00:49:02:10
Andrew
And designing, like, at least for me, I'm trying to systematize something that's not what it sounds like to you, is not systematize it. Well, I don't think it's a word, but whatever, I don't care. Or because I'm just designing my path or saying, like, I want to set process based goals versus destination based goals where it's like, okay, well, you know, the meditation, the living days and gratitude, the validation stuff.

00:49:02:12 - 00:49:27:02
Andrew
And and designing my days around. If I put in the reps for all of these process based things, then in the end, all of a sudden they'll stack up like, and I will have more balance, right? Like that's for me, like how I look at it. Right? But at this it's that's my brain looking at this.

00:49:27:07 - 00:49:38:10
Andrew
And not so much philosophy, but more like me trying to systematize what you just said. And I don't know if we're or we're talking different languages.

00:49:38:10 - 00:49:39:18
Dennis
We're not.

00:49:39:20 - 00:49:41:15
Andrew
But that's kind of how I see it.

00:49:41:15 - 00:50:06:21
Dennis
But bro, we're not. You're you're like Pac-Man who wants to run around and get all the dots? And the more dots that you have, the higher your score goes in that particular area. And so you're, you're trying to quantize.

00:50:06:23 - 00:50:09:19
Dennis
Something that.

00:50:09:21 - 00:50:52:13
Dennis
Doesn't operate that way. You do not you're not selecting puzzle pieces here and putting them all together or, you know, and I'm not saying this in a way that is is meant in it to be, like kind of sending or I know something you don't or disrespectful in any way. It's just one of the things that happens when I work with people is that I have this sort of particle wavelengths vision, where I sort of seem both, or it's not it pletely accurate.

00:50:52:13 - 00:51:26:15
Dennis
I, I see particle, but I can be wavelength and. The, the the dots analogy, the, the Pac-Man analogy is accurate because you're, you're, you're you're, you're always going you're always in movement, going toward a destination where g is met is matter sized, and little achievements lead to bigger achievements. I got all these dots. Now I got the whatever, miss Pac-Man, now I got the cherries.

00:51:26:15 - 00:52:12:19
Dennis
Now I got the frickin pretzel. Now I got the banana, you know, and and and and that's. You said somewhere in this, and I wish I had I could remember your exact language, but you said essentially something about trying to, sort of incentivize, and goal set the process. Awareness rather than. So if in other words, if if getting to check Mark one, check checkpoint one, checkpoint two, checkpoint three, checkpoint four.

00:52:12:20 - 00:52:38:10
Dennis
Like, you know, you're you're racing them you know, doing motorcross IndyCar or something. If getting to every single one of those checkpoints is has some value in and of itself. You're saying okay, well so that I don't get to the end and realize I was so had such tunnel vision that I forgot to be present with the experience.

00:52:38:12 - 00:53:14:13
Dennis
How do I incentivize use that same system? How do I create achievable checkpoint within the. Journey to make sure that I am somehow achieving presence points? Well there. So there's a word for presence point. There called moments.

00:53:14:15 - 00:53:29:17
Dennis
Like that's what they are okay. And in between the moment is this abyss of.

00:53:29:19 - 00:53:33:23
Dennis
Not consciousness. Okay.

00:53:33:23 - 00:54:08:19
Andrew
It makes me think of like the movie The Matrix, where the, the main characters and then the one guys like, well, neo is trying to figure out, is he the one? Right? And there's this moment there was like, well, you know, or the one when. Yes. Like he realizes he, oh, he controls the matrix is I forget the I forget there's a point in the movie where everyone sees him and he's able to kind of like, you know, flex the matrix and kind of become the, the bad guys.

00:54:08:19 - 00:54:26:18
Andrew
And, I mean, it's been a decade since I've seen this movie, but it feels like, you know, I'm me, me, and maybe some of the other men listening to this are kind of like neo free, you know, neo, you know, movie one versus neo movie three.

00:54:26:20 - 00:54:57:18
Dennis
Right? Yeah. When he's still in his Padawan state, do use, you know, Jedi parlance and is still learning that there's no difference between, floating the, levitating the, the lightsaber and levitating the X-Wing fighter. The reason there's no difference is because at a certain point, you understand it's all ones and zeros.

00:54:57:20 - 00:55:45:12
Dennis
So, but so getting and ones and zeros is actually a good way to roll back to what I was saying about moments of consciousness. Moments of consciousness in theory, is how we want to find presence exempt. I'll do a demonstration now, now, now, now, now, now. That is what the practice of Buddhism is like. It's like trying to maintain that thread and be like present, present, present, present, present looks up, trying to correct present, present, present chicken.

00:55:45:12 - 00:56:07:03
Dennis
The red dress up in a present, present, present. Oh juicy steak I like steak. Present, present. And so the environment that we are experiencing life in has.

00:56:07:05 - 00:56:17:05
Dennis
Distraction as it.

00:56:17:07 - 00:56:25:06
Dennis
Language fails me on this one. I guess I'll just say.

00:56:25:08 - 00:56:41:17
Dennis
If we are in a dojo again, I'm still staying with your matrix reference. We where we are learning the lesson, which is how to be.

00:56:41:19 - 00:56:48:02
Dennis
In tune with.

00:56:48:04 - 00:57:31:06
Dennis
Optimal self worth. Which we associate with self love. Then we have to do it by recognizing that self-love is experience in moments of presence where we aren't judging, we're just being. And we aren't trying to force anything. Man. Man. So I think somebody who's been living in Southern California for a minute, if I could go back to my East Coast ways, you know, it's like we're in the matrix.

00:57:31:06 - 00:57:46:15
Dennis
You walk, how do you how do you don't get this self-love, you jackass? How do you don't get this? What is stupid? But, But not seriously. It's.

00:57:46:17 - 00:58:13:06
Dennis
If you try to sit at. Just be present, present, present, present, present, present present. Watch what comes up to try to joint you off of that shrink, off of that dot that you're sitting on. Right. It's like, hey, here, you want to make a lot of money, hold this. But okay, there and then things are going to come along to try to get you to take your hand off the button.

00:58:13:08 - 00:58:44:07
Dennis
If for every second that you can hold that down, that is the only way that I can try to incentivize in this linear achievement way, like how to be present. But what happens if you do it for long enough is now we're dealing with more than just the moment. Now we start to deal with the moments between the moments and the moments between those moments, in the moments between those moments.

00:58:44:09 - 00:59:15:21
Dennis
And there will be a hit. And I'm sorry for this. Where it becomes obvious, it becomes knowable that. Time is an attempt to quantify infinity. But if you were willing to surrender to.

00:59:15:23 - 01:00:14:11
Dennis
Presence as an infinite experience for just one divine moment, you will experience infinite love, infinite intelligent intelligence, infinite singularity, and infinite connection to the multiplicity. And you will try to find words for it. And people will be like, I'll have is will get a yes or no. But the truth is, the understanding isn't profound. It's actually natural. What's problematic is recognizing that you are living in an unnatural state and trying to hide the things that make it a circle.

01:00:14:13 - 01:00:52:15
Dennis
That's what you're doing when you try to square the circle, you're trying to conveniently hide the that. That makes it not a square. Yeah. So, madam Life Coaching here today, we have talked about many the matrix love and, and and weather and instruments and geometry and Pac-Man. So more of this infinite male wisdom, please visit us at Man Up Life coaching.com or like follow and subscribe.

01:00:52:17 - 01:01:04:24
Dennis
Dennis Procopio, the bro coach and I am here with my friend and journey man. Andrew Bots. Andrew, anything else you have to say to play us off stage?

01:01:05:01 - 01:01:24:03
Andrew
You got value out of this. Any other podcasts? Give us a review on your favorite podcast. Player means a ton. We. This is something we're just do for the men out there to help grow and facilitate, great conversations between men. So spread the good word, brothers.

01:01:24:05 - 01:01:29:16
Dennis
Spread the good word, and more and more importantly, stay present. All right? Later.